Player The blessed howl's moving Castle of Stephon Javonte

[scott]

A telling stat:
Fox usage without Castle on the court (651 min): 28.9%
Fox usage with Castle on the court (484 min): 21.9%

A 28.9% usage is about what he did with Kings.
Fox is clearly taking a step back to give more touches to Castle.

I'm quite convinced that the FO Mitch are viewing this season as another development year. Spurs might be 30-14 and be the second seed, but they aren't trying to play the most efficient basketball possible. Developing the young players is the main priority.

I think you are right, which should also put and end to anything thinking we're going to do anything meaningful at the trade deadline.

Our first hint should have been the team giving a charity roster spot to Bismack Biyombo.

 

[KobesAchilles]

Mitch went to Stanford. He is obviously smarter than any arm chair coaches on this site. The dude is so good that the organization felt that they didn’t even need to do an external search for a coach. Dude is probably gonna win COY. Coaching is NOT an issue.

 

[Raven_]

It's a good point and to me it gets to the heart of this question of "what does it mean to be a PG?"

Like LeBowen mentioned, I think it's easy for casual fans to see the box score and assume the guy with the assists is the PG, when we know that's not always the case. Honestly I don't even care about the PG label, and I'm happy to just call them all guards... but for the Spurs right now, in particular, "PG" means I want Fox or Harper bringing the ball up and being the primary initiator. I think Castle can still dish out plenty of assists as the secondary ball handler, being an off ball cutter, etc. That Bucks game that RC points out is a great example.

I just think that plays best to the strengths of Fox, Harper and Castle while limiting their weaknesses. Right now we seem to be playing into all of their weaknesses... Castle drives into traffic where he either turns it over or... kicks it out to Fox for a C&S 3-pointer... yuck!

you are a pg when you can stay in front of and contest other pgs

 

[gilmor2002]

Castle TOVs seem to be inexperience rather than reckless ala Russ, Castle turns over a lot on his drives, dribbling in traffic not so much on ill passes everywhere because of tunnel vision. but let's hope he won't develop in a russ 2.0

Castle is a lot similar to TP without the speed. TP also has tunnel vision; but can cover up with his speed.

 

[spursparker9]

tbh Fox need to give the same threat to Castle as well

4 TOVs in a game and his hair will be gone

 

[MannyIG]

Castle is frustrating at times, but this is obviously an attempt to develop him knowing that at any point they can go to Fox and get that production. I am actually happy the Spurs are not pressed over trying to min max games in Janruary but instead are trying to feel out what is best for the long term with the season. I'm not going to say it isn't annoying as a fan at times, but ultimately its the right move. If Castle continues to struggle, I do think they will minimize his role but if they do that then they're almost better off sending him to the bench and letting Julian start in his place alongside Devin. But then I think that hurts Harper so IDK.

The NBA is a smart league and they adapt. Shit that works for a month gets scouted and then its up the player to adapt. Hopefully Castle has it within him to do that.

 

[brazil]

A telling stat:
Fox usage without Castle on the court (651 min): 28.9%
Fox usage with Castle on the court (484 min): 21.9%

A 28.9% usage is about what he did with Kings.
Fox is clearly taking a step back to give more touches to Castle.

I'm quite convinced that the FO Mitch are viewing this season as another development year. Spurs might be 30-14 and be the second seed, but they aren't trying to play the most efficient basketball possible. Developing the young players is the main priority.

This is basically my vision too. Spurs are playing the long run, they don't see this year as a real shot to a title and are favoring development over winning now. I think the whole Victor mn restrictions are thought with that mind as also feeding Castle a lot with usage. Spurs are lucky to have players that buy into it whether it is Harper off the bench, Victor or Fox.

 

[BatManu20]

Can't shoot but at least he can defend.

https://twitter.com/x/status/2014095357148373309

https://twitter.com/x/status/2014057953930719626

 

[SpurSpike]

I still believe Castles shot will come around, this is only his second year and he shows no fear of taking shots. More often than not he makes the shots when they matter the most, seems to have the clutch gene and a killer instinct. I cant wait to see year 3! Id even say the turnovers are tolerable and are a side effect of playing with the aggression that he does, see below.

Players with highest turnover averages this season. Notice the company?
1. Luka Doncic 4.3
2. Deni Avdija 3.9 (most in nba at 159 this season)
3. Cade Cunningham 3.8
4. Jaylen Brown 3.8
5. James Harden 3.7
6. Nikola Jokic 3.5
7. Stephon Castle 3.5

 

[spursparker9]

Wow...average 3.5 TO?

From eye test, it feels like 4 TOs per game.

 

[brazil]

I still believe Castles shot will come around, this is only his second year and he shows no fear of taking shots. More often than not he makes the shots when they matter the most, seems to have the clutch gene and a killer instinct. I cant wait to see year 3! Id even say the turnovers are tolerable and are a side effect of playing with the aggression that he does, see below.

Players with highest turnover averages this season. Notice the company?
1. Luka Doncic 4.3
2. Deni Avdija 3.9 (most in nba at 159 this season)
3. Cade Cunningham 3.8
4. Jaylen Brown 3.8
5. James Harden 3.7
6. Nikola Jokic 3.5
7. Stephon Castle 3.5

you have high very usage players in this list not really the case of Castle. Even if Spurs use Castle as primary ball handler his usage is on par with Fox and much lower than Victor but his TOV% is the highest of the team at 18,8, Fox and Victor are at 12,2. I get the aggression argument but his TOV ratio is way too high.

 

[Shmurs]

I’m not sure there’s been anyone around mentioning to castle that he’s not actually good at certain things. He kept saying things like “with my iq being so high…” earlier this year. What does he mean by that? He’s a clever guy but he makes very dumb mistakes and his processing fails him when he’s deciding to drive. He might be as smart as he thinks but how about a little humility to begin your career? This also seems like the downside of spurs culture. Everyone gets their trophies at all times.

I’ve also mentioned this in the past - he can’t be using consequential games to learn how to shoot. His infinite green light is ridiculous for a team trying to win. How many possessions do we have some incredible ball movement, only for the payoff to be an open castle 3. It happens an awful lot. It’s obviously what the other team wants and we’re giving it to them.

He really needs some kind of rule applied where he can only shoot when there’s not enough time to find a better option.

 

[OK Computer]

I’m not sure there’s been anyone around mentioning to castle that he’s not actually good at certain things. He kept saying things like “with my iq being so high…” earlier this year. What does he mean by that? He’s a clever guy but he makes very dumb mistakes and his processing fails him when he’s deciding to drive. He might be as smart as he thinks but how about a little humility to begin your career? This also seems like the downside of spurs culture. Everyone gets their trophies at all times.

I’ve also mentioned this in the past - he can’t be using consequential games to learn how to shoot. His infinite green light is ridiculous for a team trying to win. How many possessions do we have some incredible ball movement, only for the payoff to be an open castle 3. It happens an awful lot. It’s obviously what the other team wants and we’re giving it to them.

He really needs some kind of rule applied where he can only shoot when there’s not enough time to find a better option.

How to destroy a player’s confidence 101

If players even have a second of doubt about their shooting ability right before they shoot, you enter a territory you may never return from

This team is going to live and die by Castle because despite the stupid mistakes, he does have the highest IQ on the team - as displayed by the passes he executes that very few players can do.

Yes, it’s ugly right now and the hope is he turns it around and if he doesn’t? Goodbye. There is no better option for the team this season, and when I say that, the immediate reaction is we have Fox and Harper… but when I say better option, I mean for the team as a whole. Fox handling the ball and leading the way full-time… good ceiling for the team. Castle sharing those duties and performing at his best… even better ceiling for the team.

I know I’m alone on this Castle island and that’s alright. The tide will turn, IMO. And even if it doesn’t, the coaching staff is still taking a common sense approach here.

 

[2Trill]

Castle has been frustrating lately but his defense is so good its hard to take him off the floor. He's also the only guard we have that can create contact and draw fouls and also get into the paint as often as he does.

 

[Rafa]

Castle has been frustrating lately but his defense is so good its hard to take him off the floor. He's also the only guard we have that can create contact and draw fouls and also get into the paint as often as he does.

I don't think anyone is suggesting he's taken off the floor entirely, if they are they need to get a checkup at the doctor's

My main issue is how we use him. We seem 100% set on Castle being the main ball handler and play starter when he's on the floor, and it's been very hit or miss, mostly miss lately. It's very rare to have your perimeter defensive specialist also be relied upon to be the main play maker and ball handler, and also be relied upon to be a high usage scorer and slasher, and also try to improve his shooting all at once. Very few players in the history of the game have been able to do all of that at a high level, and Castle just isn't there, and we're throwing too much at him all at once when we have other avenues in the squad. We're dead set on getting him there to the detriment of the team.

I'd like us to pivot and have Fox/Wemby be the bread and butter of the team, and have Fox be the ball handler when he's on the floor, and mostly Harper when he's not. Let Castle nail down the defensive end of things, let him play off ball, let him get the benefit of less attention on him and focus on the right things. Let Fox and Wemby break down the defense and kick it to him for a drive in when the defense is scrambling, rather than him hero-ball it like he does now. This also likely gives him more open shots to work on his stroke.

It's frustrating hitting our head against the wall over and over again without trying different things. Even if you argue it's for development purposes, are we even developing the appropriate parts of his game?

 

[Shmurs]

How to destroy a player’s confidence 101

If players even have a second of doubt about their shooting ability right before they shoot, you enter a territory you may never return from

This team is going to live and die by Castle because despite the stupid mistakes, he does have the highest IQ on the team - as displayed by the passes he executes that very few players can do.

Yes, it’s ugly right now and the hope is he turns it around and if he doesn’t? Goodbye. There is no better option for the team this season, and when I say that, the immediate reaction is we have Fox and Harper… but when I say better option, I mean for the team as a whole. Fox handling the ball and leading the way full-time… good ceiling for the team. Castle sharing those duties and performing at his best… even better ceiling for the team.

I know I’m alone on this Castle island and that’s alright. The tide will turn, IMO. And even if it doesn’t, the coaching staff is still taking a common sense approach here.

Shooting is learned in the gym with thousands and thousands of repetitions. Your confidence comes from the work and the progress. He’s not some guy getting the yips, just waiting to break out. Best case is that he has a transformative offseason at some point. You aren’t going to see him drastically improve because he got game reps. He needs to dial in the mechanics and everything else.

Are you interested in winning? Then you shouldn’t like a guy who hits wide open 3’s at 31% having a green light with 14 seconds still on the clock. We’re in “winning” mode at this point. Not “gently cultivate confidence” mode. If he has time to locate a better shot, it’s his job to do so. Confidence be damned, a 50/50 chance at hitting a 2 is better than a 30% of hitting a 3. He should be finding the better 2. And we’ll see where his shooting is next fall.

 

[frenchfred]

I don't think anyone is suggesting he's taken off the floor entirely, if they are they need to get a checkup at the doctor's

My main issue is how we use him. We seem 100% set on Castle being the main ball handler and play starter when he's on the floor, and it's been very hit or miss, mostly miss lately. It's very rare to have your perimeter defensive specialist also be relied upon to be the main play maker and ball handler, and also be relied upon to be a high usage scorer and slasher, and also try to improve his shooting all at once. Very few players in the history of the game have been able to do all of that at a high level, and Castle just isn't there, and we're throwing too much at him all at once when we have other avenues in the squad. We're dead set on getting him there to the detriment of the team.

I'd like us to pivot and have Fox/Wemby be the bread and butter of the team, and have Fox be the ball handler when he's on the floor, and mostly Harper when he's not. Let Castle nail down the defensive end of things, let him play off ball, let him get the benefit of less attention on him and focus on the right things. Let Fox and Wemby break down the defense and kick it to him for a drive in when the defense is scrambling, rather than him hero-ball it like he does now. This also likely gives him more open shots to work on his stroke.

It's frustrating hitting our head against the wall over and over again without trying different things. Even if you argue it's for development purposes, are we even developing the appropriate parts of his game?

I agree, I think that the experience has been long enough. Castle won't improve his shooting dramatically without spending weeks in the gym shooting, which obviously he won't have the time during the season. We need Fox and Wemby to start developing automatisms playing together, it's not like Fox has an on/off switch that he'll be able to turn on during the playoffs, he needs repetitions with Wemby.

 

[BatManu20]

https://twitter.com/x/status/2014798433798811970

 

[Quentin_Compson]

The idea that every NBA player who puts in enough time will be at least an average shooter is weird to me. It's just basically illogical. If it were true, around 85 percent or so NBA players would be at least average shooters, but they aren't. So far, the indicators for Castle's shooting are not great. I know, I know, he has this dog in him and this great mentality and yada yada yada, but has he displayed any kind of shooting touch?
I'm not sure forcing him into being the lead guard/main creator is the best thing for his development right now.

 

[Exstatic]

The idea that every NBA player who puts in enough time will be at least an average shooter is weird to me. It's just basically illogical. If it were true, around 85 percent or so NBA players would be at least average shooters, but they aren't. So far, the indicators for Castle's shooting are not great. I know, I know, he has this dog in him and this great mentality and yada yada yada, but has he displayed any kind of shooting touch?
I'm not sure forcing him into being the lead guard/main creator is the best thing for his development right now.

It keeps him from having to shoot too many 3s.

 

[Guru of Nothing]

Wow...average 3.5 TO?

From eye test, it feels like 4 TOs per game.

A lot of those shots getting stuffed on drives to the basket feel like turnovers.

 

[CGD]

Wow...average 3.5 TO?

From eye test, it feels like 4 TOs per game.

I think that’s because he recovers a lot of his own bobbles tbh

 

[frenchfred]

The idea that every NBA player who puts in enough time will be at least an average shooter is weird to me. It's just basically illogical. If it were true, around 85 percent or so NBA players would be at least average shooters, but they aren't. So far, the indicators for Castle's shooting are not great. I know, I know, he has this dog in him and this great mentality and yada yada yada, but has he displayed any kind of shooting touch?
I'm not sure forcing him into being the lead guard/main creator is the best thing for his development right now.

Because 85% of the NBA players are not willing to do the job to get there. It is like any job, you have some people who just do their job and those who work more and excel. Adding the fact that most of them are young millionaires with a lot of temptation around them, it is easy to see most of them not putting the work in. Kobe training consisted in making 1000 shots a day, not taken, made. I bet that most NBA players are probably doing one or two tenth of that. Of course, the mechanic has to be good, that's why having a good shooting coach is important. And at the end, you are right, some players won't develop no matter what they do; let's hope for us that Castle is not in that category

 

[Seventyniner]

A lot of those shots getting stuffed on drives to the basket feel like turnovers.

Is there a stat for turnovers + times blocked? Kind of the inverse of stocks. Steph might look even worse in that metric.

I can't find a site with "times blocked" as a stat. Anyone have a place I can find that?

 

[Shmurs]

Because 85% of the NBA players are not willing to do the job to get there. It is like any job, you have some people who just do their job and those who work more and excel. Adding the fact that most of them are young millionaires with a lot of temptation around them, it is easy to see most of them not putting the work in. Kobe training consisted in making 1000 shots a day, not taken, made. I bet that most NBA players are probably doing one or two tenth of that. Of course, the mechanic has to be good, that's why having a good shooting coach is important. And at the end, you are right, some players won't develop no matter what they do; let's hope for us that Castle is not in that category

that’s…a weird theory. These guys do nothing but drills with their lives. They shoot constantly. Thousands and thousands of shots in the offseason.

If you don’t have elite control over your fine muscles and don’t have elite coordination, you can’t shoot. And those are things that your nervous system decides - not you.

Curry is curry because he’s a psycho, sure. But it’s very obviously a genetic thing. His father was built different. So is his brother to a certain extent. And he’s not just a great shooter, he’s a supernatural one. It’s not because of practice.