Spurs Third-String Center Discussion

[Raven_]

start sochan at center (sad) and play olynik and minnix for the 4-5 rotation. No barnes as center lineups, thank you.

 

[Shmurs]

what’s the gap between Thomas Bryant and Byombo? That’s what we’re talking about here. You max out at Bryant. Even guys like Huff are too expensive.

I think this just amounts to injuries being problematic and there’s not always an answer.

 

[onechance87]

You haven’t been paying attention for more than a few years. Teams are respecting players wishes in the second round nowadays. Even the Spurs have benefitted. Barlow asked teams not to draft him. I’m not sure he told teams he wanted to sign with us, but that was his intent.

If you draft a player who doesn’t want to be drafted, or drafted by you, they just have to dog it in training camp to the point you cut them, then they go sign where they wanted to in the first place, and you’ve wasted a draft pick.

I have been paying attention.He wouldint wanted want to come here because we were not gonna offer him a full nba contract.
Thats why we traded our pick.We had no intention of sigining three rookie contracts.He wanted to go to a team who was gonna offer
a nba contract,Which the kings did.

 

[Shmurs]

Ultimately we had Mamu and treated him like crap. It was swell seeing nice quotes about how good we thought he was even though we disrespected his abilities in all the ways that matter. Would have been nice to lock in a versatile 4/5, but that would have required bailing on the shitty 4/5 that the FO thought was better than Mamu.

Wouldn’t 7-8 mill and a handshake agreement to replace Sochan been more appealing than Toronto?

I have no idea what was going thru that guy’s head during his time here, watching the parade of losers get 10x his investment. I wouldn’t have wanted to be here if I was him, I guess.

 

[Exstatic]

I have been paying attention.He wouldint wanted want to come here because we were not gonna offer him a full nba contract.
Thats why we traded our pick.We had no intention of sigining three rookie contracts.He wanted to go to a team who was gonna offer
a nba contract,Which the kings did.

If you draft a player, unless there is an agreement to accept a 2way beforehand, you must offer them a minimum actual NBA contract.

 

[RC_Drunkford]

Ultimately we had Mamu and treated him like crap. It was swell seeing nice quotes about how good we thought he was even though we disrespected his abilities in all the ways that matter. Would have been nice to lock in a versatile 4/5, but that would have required bailing on the shitty 4/5 that the FO thought was better than Mamu.

Wouldn’t 7-8 mill and a handshake agreement to replace Sochan been more appealing than Toronto?

I have no idea what was going thru that guy’s head during his time here, watching the parade of losers get 10x his investment. I wouldn’t have wanted to be here if I was him, I guess.

Spurs wouldn't play Mamu regular rotation minutes, which is why he went to Toronto because they gave him a role coming off the bench. Nothing wrong with that. He's not a shotblocker, although he would be a better PF than Sochan in our current system.

 

[scott]

Hear me out… Drew Eubanks.

Let’s bring him home

I hated Drew's play pretty much entire time here... but I'll add him to a long list of former Spurs C's who I'd rather have than Bismack right now.

Drew
Jock
CBass

Pretty much anyone but Zollins, tbqh

 

[scott]

what’s the gap between Thomas Bryant and Byombo? That’s what we’re talking about here. You max out at Bryant. Even guys like Huff are too expensive.

I think this just amounts to injuries being problematic and there’s not always an answer.

Not sure what you mean by "too expensive" but Huff only makes $2.3MM this season (which is less than what Biyombo makes, and slightly more than Bismack's cap hit).

The problem isn't Huff's pay... it's that he's graduated beyond a 3rd stringer role.

 

[Splits]

If you draft a player, unless there is an agreement to accept a 2way beforehand, you must offer them a minimum actual NBA contract.

What? If you're talking about 2nd round picks, you are very wrong. Teams can offer non-guaranteed deals. They can offer an Exhibit 10 contract which doesn't even tie up a roster spot and costs peanuts as you can just dump them to the GL. They don't have to sign them at all and let them become free agents.

 

[Bruno]

To me, there are two main questions regarding the third string center situation:

First, French Vanilla:
Will pairing Wembanyama and Kornet be something Mitch will do on a regular basis? In that case, it increases the quality required for the third string center because that player will play outside of injuries and foul troubles.

Second, Olynyk:
On the paper, even an aging Olynyk is way good enough to fill that spot and Spurs spend quite a lot of money to add him to the team. On the court, he hasn't been able to do a lot. To his credit, he has been out for 6 months with a heel surgery. At nearly 35 years old, is he done or does he just need a little more time to get back at a good level?

 

[Exstatic]

What? If you're talking about 2nd round picks, you are very wrong. Teams can offer non-guaranteed deals. They can offer an Exhibit 10 contract which doesn't even tie up a roster spot and costs peanuts as you can just dump them to the GL. They don't have to sign them at all and let them become free agents.

Every second round pick, barring a negotiated arrangement for a 2way or gleague deal in advance, must be offered a minimum salary NBA contract to hold the player’s rights. It can be completely unguaranteed, and usually is.

The discussion here is about players telling teams not to draft them. They can do that, refuse to accept a 2way or gleague offer, force the tender, and crash out in training camp.

 

[DTW]

If we’re looking at third sting, we should target defense, not floor stretching. Jalen isn’t great on D.

I view Smith as not only a third C, but as another double big option.

As hybrid C's often seem to, I think Wembanyama prefers it and they need it on a team where the only true PF, Sochan, is a non shooter mostly being utilized as a small ball C.

If they're going to acquire a rotation caliber rim runner, then Sochan should be in the trade because I don't think they'd play them ahead of him and they definitely can't play together.

 

[Splits]

Every second round pick, barring a negotiated arrangement for a 2way or gleague deal in advance, must be offered a minimum salary NBA contract to hold the player’s rights. It can be completely unguaranteed, and usually is.

The discussion here is about players telling teams not to draft them. They can do that, refuse to accept a 2way or gleague offer, force the tender, and crash out in training camp.

Or they can draft them, player shows his crank to the masseuse or ODs on heroin in SL and they dump him with no contract ever offered.

 

[The Truth #6]

What archetype are we realistically prioritizing?

1. Unathletic Euro type with good fundamentals?
2. Earthbound grizzled veteran who sets bone-crushing picks?
3. Young deer lost on mismanaged team with glimpses of statistical defensive dominance?

 

[Shmurs]

Not sure what you mean by "too expensive" but Huff only makes $2.3MM this season (which is less than what Biyombo makes, and slightly more than Bismack's cap hit).

The problem isn't Huff's pay... it's that he's graduated beyond a 3rd stringer role.

Why did I see huff at 10 mill? Bad intel, my bad. That would have been a good get.

 

[Exstatic]

What archetype are we realistically prioritizing?

1. Unathletic Euro type with good fundamentals?
2. Earthbound grizzled veteran who sets bone-crushing picks?
3. Young deer lost on mismanaged team with glimpses of statistical defensive dominance?

Shot blocker, rim runner.

 

[Exstatic]

Or they can draft them, player shows his crank to the masseuse or ODs on heroin in SL and they dump him with no contract ever offered.

The point, nearly lost in your histrionics, is that players do have a say in whether you draft them or not in the second round.

It’s hard enough turning a second rounder into an NBA player. The needle would tilt towards impossible if they didn’t want to be on your team, for whatever reason.

 

[The Truth #6]

Shot blocker, rim runner.

That's the "glass half full" interpretation, I imagine.

So then, diving deeper, young player with hints of promise, or someone established with zero upside?

 

[Exstatic]

That's the "glass half full" interpretation, I imagine.

So then, diving deeper, young player with hints of promise, or someone established with zero upside?

Probably the latter. If the young player shows his quality, we lose him.

 

[scott]

Why did I see huff at 10 mill? Bad intel, my bad. That would have been a good get.

He's on a 4/10, that's probably what you saw. He definitely would have been a good get. IND got him from MEM for two seconds. He was another in a long list of two-way finds by the Grizzlies. Their scouting and development program is great... and then it all falls apart because Ja is a clown and JJJ is flawed

 

[Guru of Nothing]

I would not mind Mason Plumlee and his 2.3M expiring, solely as insurance through the playoffs. Kornet/Olynyk/Plumlee ain't bad for a backup rotation.

Would like it even more if we drafted C's with 2nd round picks as default practice.

 

[SpursBills]

One draft guy who I think is getting slept on in all the mocks who really fits everything the spurs are looking for might be Johann Gruenloh. His countryman Steinbach gets all the attention and is currently mocked lottery, but Grunloh is either completely off a ton of mocks or mocked as a mid to end of round 2nd rounder. I think he's having an anomalously bad FT shooting season (<50%) where his seasons in Europe were generally 60-70%. He's listed at 7 feet, 7'2-7'4 wingspan, is top 15 in the country in BLK%, and puts up about 5 3PM per 100 and pretty routinely could make 3s in Europe, and will still be just 20 on draft day. He's probably going to slip because his offensive counting stats are low and teams are only going to look at this season's FT shooting, but this makes him undervalued imo as he has the size and quick enough feet to function as both rim protector and not be a complete sieve switching out the perimeter (STL% 2.0), while still having outs to space the floor. If Wemby is going to miss extended time each season, that 3rd string center really needs to offer good rim protection so our defense just doesn't hemorrhage points, and this guy is a low-cost way to do that.

He's also got that nice intersection of OREB% (14), AST:TO (>1), and STL% (2) that I look for that marks a guy with decent instincts and decent athleticism with potential for better-than-expected development. If his production keeps up I'm taking him with the Jazz second rounder unless someone insane drops.

 

[scott]

If Wemby is going to miss extended time each season, that 3rd string center really needs to offer good rim protection so our defense just doesn't hemorrhage points, and this guy is a low-cost way to do that.

This is exactly why it is utterly shocking to me that the FO has done nothing to address Bismack's spot over the last 11 games. Maybe they're also surprised Wemby is missing this many games? Maybe they think this is a complete fluke?

But it's irresponsible to have a guy on the roster who is basically unplayable in such a high impact role when Wemby is out (which is likely to happen again).

I wonder if when they coaxed him out of retirement last year, or perhaps this past summer, they made some kind of promise to him? Why they would do this, I do not know...

At the very least, I cannot understand why one of Ingram or Minix isn't cut and someone like Micah Potter is given that two-way spot instead. I'm not relying on us finding a two way gem, but surely there are two-way guys out there who can contribute more than Bismack is?

 

[The Truth #6]

They do need to get more serious/active in addressing the end of bench players. Harrison Ingram and Minnix have been here awhile now. It's time to roll the dice on new players again. I know the FO is risk averse but we have our stars, this should be the less stressful part of roster management as far as expectations, which are low with third stringers.

But this gets to the sensitive subject of whether or not Wright has an eye for bench player non-star talent evaluation.

 

[scott]

But this gets to the sensitive subject of whether or not Wright has an eye for bench player non-star talent evaluation.

On Vecenie's last podcast he mentioned that he knows that not every team even has a Pro Personnel Scouting department... which is crazy to me. I don't know if the Spurs do or not... but in reality this really shouldn't be reliant on Wright. We should have pro scouts who are feeding him targets for these kinds of roles.