Trade There is Trey Murphy III to San Antonio Buzz

scott

scott

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scott said:

This is not new... but this rumor started right when ST started shitting the bed so we never got to talk about it. Seems like the perfect kind of thread to be our first 10+ (then 20+, then 30+, then 100+) pager.

Devin + picks for TMIII works in the trade machine.
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I’m not as big of a hater of Devin as others are but this would be a move worth attaching a 1st to.
 
given the lack of serious follow through on this story it looks like it was a quick cursory call at best and no real interest in moving the parts necessary. dont blame them. pels probably wanted multiple picks
 
Usually the rebuttal would be what GM would do that move, but the Pels are run by Joe Dumass. So maybe there is hope.
 
To me Devin is a lot like Dejounte...empty stats. DM is proving he doesn't make teams better, and I'd say the same about Devin. I think he views himself as more impactful than he really is.

If a team would trade for him and give the Spurs anything of near-equal value I'd do it all day long. I don't think the Spurs need to throw in kickers to sweeten the deal though. No need to dump Devin for fire-sale return.
 
Ed Helicopter Jones said:
To me Devin is a lot like Dejounte...empty stats. DM is proving he doesn't make teams better, and I'd say the same about Devin. I think he views himself as more impactful than he really is.

If a team would trade for him and give the Spurs anything of near-equal value I'd do it all day long. I don't think the Spurs need to throw in kickers to sweeten the deal though. No need to dump Devin for fire-sale return.
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its a bummer because devin came into the league as a complementary 3&D type which is perfect. and he has enough length/strength to get by at the 3. but his defense has largely fallen off a cliff, the 3pt shot has been good not great, and his offense is really built to be a bench scorer and not a complementary starter
 
I’m okay moving Devin with multiple picks for TM3. At 25 and what seems to be the position in need, mobile defensive stretch 4. I like Devin at 6th man, but I doubt he’ll be thrilled at that position.
 
I sort of understand the TMIII love here but I think people are falling for the same tank commander numbers KJ3 and DV put up during our crap years.

Compare their best years (my subjective take):

PTSREBASTSTLBLKTOV2P%3P%FG%
TMIII21.25.13.51.10.71.955.636.145.4
KJ22.06.12.10.80.21.251.039.846.6
DV19.53.84.11.10.31.654.437.247.2

Not only are the numbers similar, the trajectory is similar as well. Bad rookie year, OK soph, signs of promise the 3rd, then best year in the fourth. It's scary.

When you look at the advanced numbers:

ORTGDRTGWS/48OBPMDBPMBPMVORPUSG%TS%
TMIII1181120.0912.1-1.40.81.323.759.8
KJ1081220.0300.7-2.5-1.80.127.955.1
DV1131180.0770.9-0.90.01.123.557.8

I'd say even though TMIII looks better, the flows of lack of defence (I'd say O and D ratings are more constructs of the team and should be viewed as part of how the team functions, but I am too lazy to go into the details), and his numbers are very similar to DV.

Don't get me wrong, I think TMIII looks way better and I have been saying about getting rid of DV for a long time because of how he plays the game. I think TMIII can be a better long range sniper if need be, but fact is DV, even last year, shot 36.8% 3 on 10.5 attempts/100 possessions, compared to 36.1% on 11.4.

In terms of shooting splits, TMIII also is taking on more offensive responsibilities, where he has gone from mid 90s in 3P assisted down to 89% in the 3rd year and then down to 85% last year, but his 2Ps are assisted more going from 55% to 66, 68 and 69%. it goes with the eye tests with him having more pull ups on 3s and more cuts to the basket.

His % of FG from 3 has dropped from 72% in year 3 to 52% on year 4, and those shots have in turn moved much closer to the basket (14% to 22% on 0-3, and 14% to 22% on 3-10).

All of this, and I am in the camp of not going overboard if a trade is on the table. DV plus some sweeteners works for me (like a 1st round pick projected in the 20s plus a boatload of 2nds), but anything more than that I would backoff.
 
Great breakdown. I like TM3 but I don't think the price to acquire him is going to be palatable and he won't be worth it as an upgrade to DV. Because he is better obviously but is he really THAT much better considering price? He has some very legit durability concerns as well.

If we're looking at Pels wing players I'd rather target Herb Jones
 
murphy's play style is just a very obvious upgrade to what DV has given us. much quicker decision maker with the ball. very "shit or get off the pot" approach with him, as opposed to devin catching it, slowing down, surveying floor, getting into flow of his iso game, etc.

he's also taller, longer, and more athletic
 
spurraider21 said:
murphy's play style is just a very obvious upgrade to what DV has given us. much quicker decision maker with the ball. very "shit or get off the pot" approach with him, as opposed to devin catching it, slowing down, surveying floor, getting into flow of his iso game, etc.

he's also taller, longer, and more athletic
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I think everybody agrees over the fact he is an upgrade DV.. question is how much are we willing to pay for this upgrade
 
brazil said:
I think everybody agrees over the fact he is an upgrade DV.. question is how much are we willing to pay for this upgrade
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I’m not sure that those comparative numbers show that he is. His numbers were not that different from DV and Keldon, and were put up on a bad team. Wasn’t that the complaint about our two, that they’re just tank commanders?
 
I don't see the Spurs breaking up this squad before it's hit the hardwood. Maybe there will be a trade or two by the deadline, but, not of this magnitude. I love TMIII, but, I'm not 100% sold on his adaptability to playing with Wemby, Fox, et al. I like him at the 3 more than as a stretch 4 for the most part. If it's a Vassell upgrade, then, yes. I assume that the Spurs will stick with HB through this season, at least.

On the other side, what would Dumars want with any Spurs player other than Wemby, Fox, Castle or Harper?

To my sensibilities, our biggest need is a tough, big-bodied 4 who can rebound and shoot 3's.
 
brazil said:
I think everybody agrees over the fact he is an upgrade DV.. question is how much are we willing to pay for this upgrade
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true. i wouldnt give more than 1 FRP. i'd give a slew of seconds tho. but i really doubt NOP goes for that. since we already emptied some of the cupboard with the Fox deal, spurs shouldnt be making extremely aggressive (multiple FRP) moves unless they think this is the move that puts them over the top. we're not there yet. maybe in a few months if it really seems that things are firing on all cylinders, you consider it
 
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I love TMIII, but @ambchang brings up a great point that I agree with. Same with Lauri, who I also still think would be AWESOME on our team (though I don't love his contract).

These Tank Commanding Stat Padders come with caution warnings. Though, sometimes they just need a change of scenery. Someone like Devin or KJ might actually be capable of growing and being contributing players on a winning team if they got a lit bit of a dose of reality in a trade. It didn't necessarily work out for DJM (though it's not like he completely fell off after here and injuries have been the main story there). But I feel like maybe these guys are too much in a comfort zone and it's hard to just flip the switch to being someone else when you're wearing the same kit, driving the same route to work, etc.
 
scott said:
Someone like Devin or KJ might actually be capable of growing and being contributing players on a winning team if they got a lit bit of a dose of reality in a trade.
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Hopefully we find out about that by this time next year at the latest. :)
 
If the Pels and Dumars wanted some flair on their team instead of Devin... KJ + Sochan for TMIII also works in the trade machine :devilish:
 
scott said:
If the Pels and Dumars wanted some flair on their team instead of Devin... KJ + Sochan for TMIII also works in the trade machine :devilish:
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Dude, total bait for me.

I actually typed out a gigantic thesis comparing Sochan and Aaron Gordon numbers early in their careers, it was incredible how similar the numbers were. I was smart enough to copy it on my clipboard before pressing submit, then Spurstalk died. I was like "no big deal", I have it on the clipboard. Then overnight my desktop overheated and had a hard restart, son of a ....

Anyways, the long and short of it is that Sochan and Gordan had pretty much identical numbers, with Sochan actually being a better rebounder. Other than raw stats, I compared their advanced stats as well.

I finally compared Sochan's numbers with Wemby vs. without, and more importantly Wemby's numbers with Sochan vs. without, and I am pretty convinced that even though Sochan had a slight negative impact on Wemby's offensive numbers, he more than made up for them with his defence. I also looked up the team numbers with Sochan playing with a playmaker (CP3 being the only one, pretty much) and without, and Sochan checks out to be a good finisher who actually helps the team on offence a bit with a creator feeding him the ball.

I forgot all the numbers I looked up and most definitely not the actual numbers, but ultimately, the conclusion I drew was that Gordan didn't really shook the "bust" label until he was paired with a generational passing big like Jokic, I am not sure if Wemby will ever be that astute of a creator/passer, but I am not counting that out. Also, with playmakers like Harper joining the team, and then creators like Fox, and to an extent Castle it he mix, Sochan can grow into a fifth finisher option on offence, almost like the role Capella played for a while with Harden.

I know times have changed but those rockets, with Capella who didn't even attempt a three, somehow led the league in 3pm at 16.1, that's almost 3 more than the 2nd placed team. Even compared to 2025, that would placed them 2nd in the league behind the Celtics. Of course shooting wise that team had Harden, Gordon, CP3, and PJ Tucker, but if the team can create an offence that forces the defence to constantly rotate, a player like Sochan, who can't shoot at all, may still have a place in the offence.
 
ambchang said:
Dude, total bait for me.
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I'm not quite ready to go into full blown debate over Sochan... I'm still in the new message board honeymoon phase... so I'll just say... I think it's unlikely Sochan ever amounts to anything... but he's young enough to not give up on yet (though I'm also not willing to extend him right now) unless you're getting positive value in return.

We will find out soon enough... but I think Sochan's role will actually surprise people to start the year (in that I don't think it will be as large as some people might think)
 
I'd love this to happen, but if it doesn't, who are the 3 next best options that fit the need?
 
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