Spurs strategy in the clutch.

[Fabbs]

Purpose of this potentially ongoing thread (to infinity and beyond with Wemby ERA and the Spurs 6 Championships?) is to analyze strategy in the clutch.
What is clutch? Well lets say late 4th qtrs for sure but limit that down. Like final 2 minutes and perhaps we wanna make it final minute only? Final 30 seconds? I'm open.
1. We undoubtedly will not all agree on what was and is and will be best.
The atmosphere should be engaging and we all got the memo, don't be a dick.

2. If you can embed the play(s) so much the better.
Here's one to get us started:

 

[Exstatic]

I think the NBA defines it as a game within 5 points in the last 5 minutes. Anyone else remember different?

 

[Mugen]

Related - but I've always agreed with Pop about not playing the foul game when you're up by 3 with like <15 sec left in the game.

Was interesting to see Mitch & Co. employ that tactic against OKC(?) in the Cup game IIRC.

I'm sure analytics says you should foul in that situation but I've never been a fan, too much bullshit happens where you can end up losing the game instead of OT as worst case scenario.

 

[Fabbs]

3 late trey attempts in the final 49 seconds of the Spurs win over NY on New Years Eve Wed 31st:
Do you agree with the D strategy on all 3?
49 seconds left. Harry Barners does a double back step jumper from just inside the foul line.
The shot falls short for an airball, or on my 3rd view perhaps Harry was purposely passing it to Korny under the basket? If so what a nice pass. Maybe not on purpose.
Regardless Korny catches the shot and flips it in left handed while getting fouled.
(We have got to get the film clip of Korny then doing a shimy and pumping his arms while on his back on the floor.)
126 - 123 Spurs.
Korny missed the FT, but the karoom has one if not two NY's fouling Keldon. KJ sinks both FTs.
128-123 Spurs still at 49 seconds left.
:40 KJ with a nifty steal of Brunson and pinned the ball on the floor, but it's ruled a kick before the steal.
Inbounds. Brunson bricks a trey and the bounce is so high it gets tipped by both Spurs and NYY. Brunson luckily greasily gets the ball tapped out to him up high by logo.
Now :29 left. Brunson drives and does the sudden stop and step back. In fast motion it looks like Brunson did one his rip off arm push offs to gain space to shoot. But on replay he did not. Fox simply slipped. Leaving Brunson wide open for the trey. He makes it.
Here is where i am a little fried. Spurs were up 5 should have been playing to defend the trey much better. It was a flukey bounce of a rebound but still. Now 128-126 Ok there is 2 more treys to go.

Harry Barnes sinks both clutch FTs for 130 - 126
NY upcourt, damned if Spurs didn't let Brunson get off another trey. He bricked. Do you agree with letting Brunson shoot a 3, especially since he gets the pamper calls with his redic flopping? He misses.

13 seconds left as KJ sinks both clutch FTs.
132-126 Spurs.
10 seconds NOW the Spurs play tight D? Yes Harry Barnes is right up on McBride on the trey attempt. Do you want Harry playing this tight of D when up 6 with :10 to go?
McBride jumps into Harry. A BS foul call? What is the latest with Stern Jr. / NBA on offensive shooters jumping into defenders. Sean thought it was an offensive foul on NY. McBride is give 3 FTs. Should Harry have been playing that tight of D? From one angle it looks like a total BS call. On another it does look like Harry may have gotten his arm in McBrides shooting arms way. Legs? No way that is McBride jumping into Harry all the way.

What do you want the Spurs doing up 4 with 10 seconds left.

 

[Fabbs]

Related - but I've always agreed with Pop about not playing the foul game when you're up by 3 with like <15 sec left in the game.

Was interesting to see Mitch & Co. employ that tactic against OKC(?) in the Cup game IIRC.

I'm sure analytics says you should foul in that situation but I've never been a fan, too much bullshit happens where you can end up losing the game instead of OT as worst case scenario.

2013 Game 6 vs Miami to give Timmy Dunks his well deserved undefeated record and Finals MVP?
Of course that was a massive out-of-position strategy by the Spurs even letting Lebron and then Allen ever get those attempts off.
Whether the Spurs fouled there or not, should have never been in that defensive position.

 

[scott]

3 late trey attempts in the final 49 seconds of the Spurs win over NY on New Years Eve Wed 31st:
Do you agree with the D strategy on all 3?
49 seconds left. Harry Barners does a double back step jumper from just inside the foul line.
The shot falls short for an airball, or on my 3rd view perhaps Harry was purposely passing it to Korny under the basket? If so what a nice pass. Maybe not on purpose.
Regardless Korny catches the shot and flips it in left handed while getting fouled.
(We have got to get the film clip of Korny then doing a shimy and pumping his arms while on his back on the floor.)
126 - 123 Spurs.
Korny missed the FT, but the karoom has one if not two NY's fouling Keldon. KJ sinks both FTs.
128-123 Spurs still at 49 seconds left.
:40 KJ with a nifty steal of Brunson and pinned the ball on the floor, but it's ruled a kick before the steal.
Inbounds. Brunson bricks a trey and the bounce is so high it gets tipped by both Spurs and NYY. Brunson luckily greasily gets the ball tapped out to him up high by logo.
Now :29 left. Brunson drives and does the sudden stop and step back. In fast motion it looks like Brunson did one his rip off arm push offs to gain space to shoot. But on replay he did not. Fox simply slipped. Leaving Brunson wide open for the trey. He makes it.
Here is where i am a little fried. Spurs were up 5 should have been playing to defend the trey much better. It was a flukey bounce of a rebound but still. Now 128-126 Ok there is 2 more treys to go.

Harry Barnes sinks both clutch FTs for 130 - 126
NY upcourt, damned if Spurs didn't let Brunson get off another trey. He bricked. Do you agree with letting Brunson shoot a 3, especially since he gets the pamper calls with his redic flopping? He misses.

13 seconds left as KJ sinks both clutch FTs.
132-126 Spurs.
10 seconds NOW the Spurs play tight D? Yes Harry Barnes is right up on McBride on the trey attempt. Do you want Harry playing this tight of D when up 6 with :10 to go?
McBride jumps into Harry. A BS foul call? What is the latest with Stern Jr. / NBA on offensive shooters jumping into defenders. Sean thought it was an offensive foul on NY. McBride is give 3 FTs. Should Harry have been playing that tight of D? From one angle it looks like a total BS call. On another it does look like Harry may have gotten his arm in McBrides shooting arms way. Legs? No way that is McBride jumping into Harry all the way.

What do you want the Spurs doing up 4 with 10 seconds left.

FWIW, the L2M report did say that Barnes should NOT have been called for a foul on that McBride attempt at 0:10 remaining.

Fun thread, I'll be looking forward to see how this one progresses! Don't have anything to add right now but I appreciate you making this topic!

 

[LeBowen]

Related - but I've always agreed with Pop about not playing the foul game when you're up by 3 with like <15 sec left in the game.

Was interesting to see Mitch & Co. employ that tactic against OKC(?) in the Cup game IIRC.

I'm sure analytics says you should foul in that situation but I've never been a fan, too much bullshit happens where you can end up losing the game instead of OT as worst case scenario.

These days it's way risker due to all the bs jumpshot foul calls, but back in the day it should've been done more.
Not too early, but I'd always do it if your opponent has no more time-outs left and it's less than 10 seconds on the clock.
Especially if it's a 4+ point game.

Even if it's a 1 point game after you foul them and they make FTs, making yours to bring it back to 3 with 5ish seconds left seems like a no brainer compared to trying to defend a drawn up play with so many good shooters in the league these days.

 

[Exstatic]

2013 Game 6 vs Miami to give Timmy Dunks his well deserved undefeated record and Finals MVP?
Of course that was a massive out-of-position strategy by the Spurs even letting Lebron and then Allen ever get those attempts off.
Whether the Spurs fouled there or not, should have never been in that defensive position.

I’m in the minority here,but that whole sequence was on Manu. Miami misses a three, and gets the rebound in the mid baseline. Manu tries to draw an offensive foul, which is NEVER going to be called in those circumstances, the ball is kicked to Ray Asshole,and he travels and sinks the Trey. The correct play on that rebound is to SLAP DOWN AS HARD AS YOU CAN ON THE BALL. Maybe you get a steal,maybe you get a foul on the floor call for two FTs.. Either is better than a three.

 

[Mugen]

2013 Game 6 vs Miami to give Timmy Dunks his well deserved undefeated record and Finals MVP?
Of course that was a massive out-of-position strategy by the Spurs even letting Lebron and then Allen ever get those attempts off.
Whether the Spurs fouled there or not, should have never been in that defensive position.

Manu and Kawhi choking FTs and Pop not leaving Timmy in the game for the rebound were the bigger issues tbh IMO.

 

[Mugen]

These days it's way risker due to all the bs jumpshot foul calls, but back in the day it should've been done more.
Not too early, but I'd always do it if your opponent has no more time-outs left and it's less than 10 seconds on the clock.
Especially if it's a 4+ point game.

Even if it's a 1 point game after you foul them and they make FTs, making yours to bring it back to 3 with 5ish seconds left seems like a no brainer compared to trying to defend a drawn up play with so many good shooters in the league these days.

Agreed about doing it in the bolded scenario. But it was a 3pt game with like 12ish seconds left when Mitch did it IIRC. I just look it as you need a lot more separate events (inbounding the ball, making each of your FTs, not fouling them, etc.) to go right instead of just defend + secure the rebound.

Again, im sure analytics says im in the wrong but i'm sticking with vibes tbh

 

[LeBowen]

Agreed about doing it in the bolded scenario. But it was a 3pt game with like 12ish seconds left when Mitch did it IIRC. I just look it as you need a lot more separate events (inbounding the ball, making each of your FTs, not fouling them, etc.) to go right instead of just defend + secure the rebound.

Again, im sure analytics says im in the wrong but i'm sticking with vibes tbh

The biggest risk is not making the FTs, which is a legit concern with some of our players.
And then you look like an idiot for losing the FT game you started.